Comments on: Suffering

By: Barbara

Barbara — Sun, 25 Sep 2011 11:05:31 +0000

Dear Paulo,
I just finished reading your “Aleph” and immediatly felt the need to write you…
I feel I shall punctuate that I don’t always write to the authors of what I read, I actually never did so before…
I haven’t read all of your books, but I noticed that when I happen to read one it always happens in “the right moment”.
I stumbled upon Aleph last thursday, 24 hours after having discovered the baby who was growing within me had ceased to live nearly one month before, while I was looking for “a few” books to help me run away from what I was living.
Of course I knew that Aleph wasn’t likely to offer me an escape in the world of fantasy, but I somehow felty it would have offered other, something I needed though feared.
Immediatly after finishing the reading I felt I wanted to write you and to thank you; I din’t know how to do so but I remembered that in the book you mentioned your blog and here I am.
I don’t know if you personally read all the comments on it (it looks like an enormous effort) neither if you will happen to read mine, but I think that it’s anyway important to me to try and reach you with these words, maybe you will read them, maybe it won’t matter, maybe somebody else will and that will result to be the reason for my writing them…
Last wednesday night I was feeling a huge pain, both emotionally and physically, and I said to my husband I would have been ready to accept it if it was to give life to our child, but I could not bear I was going through that when He/she had anyway died… I wanted to find a reason, a meaning; I knew it was somehow there, just beyond my reach, but could not find it…
Then I had to go through medical care and to try and begin facing the healing period, which I knew would have been rather a psychological then a physical matter…
I had bought 7 books, 5 of them were fantasy, the last 2 were Redfield’s Twelfth Enlightenment (I’m trying to re-translate the title from Italian, but I’m sure it should be near enough to let understand what I’m writing about) and your Aleph. I had thought it would have been wise to start from the “lighter” books and to leave these latter for a few days foward, but of course I then acted the other way round…

Well, I can’t say I’ve fully healed, nor that I completely accepted what happened, but I want to thank you because reading Aleph helped me aaccepting part of my suffering and understanding a few things I’d like to list here, maybe for myself, maybe for others, I don’t actually know…

1) My child, in this life and occasion, didn’t stay with me for even a couple of months; but it hasn’t ceased to live and exist somewhere else on “the trein of life”!

2) If he/she chose to “come” and quite abruptely “go” there is a reason (that I might come to understand it or not) or more precisely there are some reasons, one linked to me, one linked to Him/her, one linked to my husband and so on… and each one has a meaning and an aim in our individual path.

3) A friend of mine who has gone through the same experience a few weeks earlier than me told me that she wants to make so that her experience makes sense in her life, makes her a better person and halps her understanding other women facing it… We both are psychoterapists and I start feeling it is being so also for me. I already know I will soon have to do something witha patient: up to now I had colluded with her feeling of guilt and had tried to help her having her understanding that she couldn’t have done anything different seen her stage in her evolutional path (she had feared becoming a mother since she still had unsolved matters with her own and had overworked during the pregnancy); now I know she couldn’t have done nothing at all, cause nothin was there to be done.

4) I also know I could do nothing cause nothing was there to be done and I’m starting to accept something I’ve always had troubles to deal with: not being almighty that is being impotent.

5) since this part of your forum is related to suffering and I instinctively chose it while wandering in which section to write I found myself thinking about the quetion “is suffering necessary” and I think: no, it isn’t… nevertheless I think that when we happen to step into it may as well be worth taking what we can out of it.

6) Eventually I want to thank you for havin warned us readers from procedind to do the excercise of the fire ring… I was immediately temped by it, even because I had already happened to see parts of my previous lifes and in the last years I had felt quite frustrated by the fact that it had not happened again. After reading your warning I realised it would have been a very bad idea to try just now: when it happened I had been quite centered and even so it had been quite destabilizing, I can’t immagine what would have happened just now!

7) There is a time for any single thing, that we accept it or not, sometimes -as in my case- suffering derives from our incapability to accept that that time is not when it would like it to be. But, as I wrote on my facebook page: if you accept it things are like that; if you don’t accept it things are still like that.

THANK AGAIN!!!!!

Thank you
I am also posting your text in http://paulocoelhoblog.com/2010/08/10/o-aleph-comentarios-de-leitores/

Barbara

By: Sopinion

Sopinion — Thu, 18 Aug 2011 21:07:37 +0000

I guess everyone needs to suffer in a way or other to get what he wants,because if everything was easy with no suffer,it will be worthless.

By: luis

luis — Mon, 25 Jul 2011 10:25:25 +0000

I think we need to suffer once in a while. Life is not about happiness and success, it is also bounded with sufferings and pain for us to be able to distinguish the consequences of our actions and the reason of our sufferings. We suffer so we can learn. Sufferings make us better and stonger.

By: chaman

chaman — Tue, 07 Jun 2011 05:48:05 +0000

in hinduism the suffering of any type is said to be the result of your actions ,may be of pest life because we believe in rebirth . even whatever we way suffer in relationships is also said to be because of past relationships that is whatever we have done to that person good or bad in this birth in some way he or she will take from us or give to us .

By: Sofia

Sofia — Sun, 24 Apr 2011 12:54:45 +0000

“suffering as a justification for us to go to heaven, or to sacrifice to others.”
I’ve always thought that suffering is wrong and it brings nothing but pain, but in the name of my kids i chose to suffer in my marriage because of them to be happy. It did not have a meaning again ( we separated anyway) but somehow probably Jesus suffered for us (his children). Anyway we suffer, so it must have some meaning.

By: gabriela

gabriela — Wed, 09 Mar 2011 01:58:02 +0000

This is the enlightenment in my opinion. . . We all have to work to fight suffering:patiently we must turn this gigantic stone in a myriad of shining pebbles of joy . .

By: gabriela

gabriela — Wed, 09 Mar 2011 01:02:23 +0000

As like as I feel , suffering is part of the life, after or before. We don’t look for it but we meet it in our path, that is also the path of people we love,or simply of our neighbour. Well, when we meet suffering we can open better our eyes, our mind and our hearth and then we’ll do the best to turn it in little moments of joy, much more as we can.Then we can’t not to know our gift,our path: We’ll sure realize the sense of the life.For these reasons, in my opinion I think, unfortunately, suffering gets some sort of enlightenment.Thanks to you all for the opportunity you give to a reflection. Love

By: fe valdivia cruz

fe valdivia cruz — Sun, 16 Jan 2011 20:49:16 +0000

Sufferongs are the results of our wrong decisions .

By: Chablis

Chablis — Sat, 25 Dec 2010 17:33:45 +0000

Your point of view does not necessarily apply to all…Of course,suffering is something we can do without but in the case of Dostoevsky…it was not his choice and yes,there is a gap of difference.

By: Chablis

Chablis — Sun, 19 Dec 2010 20:53:24 +0000

“No hay nada mas sagrado que el sufrimiento humano”.
_Fyodor Dostoevsky
“Nothing more sacred than human suffering.”
Dostoevsky knew what he was talking about pertaining human suffering.

By: timberix

timberix — Sun, 19 Dec 2010 16:17:58 +0000

Suffering is necessary. But it must be intentional. Don’t mix it with voluntary suffering. We have to suffer in order to help others, trying not to miss any opportunity.
To suffer for the benefit of others, this is called intentional suffering.

By: Dave C

Dave C — Thu, 28 Oct 2010 19:41:05 +0000

I suspect we all must travel the path that is right for us. Some to suffer great, some less. Perhaps if we learn to listen very carefully, we can avoid or limit the depth at which the repeating lessons we are to learn must go to get through to us. And if we are completely honest with ourselves about what we are hearing. Perhaps in the end, suffering is not any different from non-suffering, it is all what is.

By: Gina

Gina — Fri, 22 Oct 2010 03:49:28 +0000

Life will bring us pain. But we can choose whether we want to suffer or not. Letting go is hard to do but holding on to pain is suffering. Love yourself and be true to who you are. Live to love, not fear or suffer.

By: Joel

Joel — Mon, 18 Oct 2010 17:35:58 +0000

Correction i am suffering because i don’t understand the
language of my Heart.

By: Joel

Joel — Mon, 18 Oct 2010 17:33:44 +0000

We are suffering because we don’t know the language
of our heart.

By: lee

lee — Wed, 06 Oct 2010 13:12:42 +0000

I am a little divided on this matter as I have experienced suffering in my life yet it did not always make me more conscious or kind. Sometimes it made me harder and more aggressive as I did not have the time for compassion or time to understand what was at hand in a deeper fashion giving me better insights on how to deal with what was going on in my life.

Enlightenment for me only became a desire of mine after I lost my husband and partner of 20 years. I wanted to understand “why life/ why death”? What lies behind life is my driver and through lifting and inspecting my soul and understanding Spirituality this allows me to inspect myself at a far deeper level and helps me gain insight at a far wider level.
I have also come to learn through loss that by enlightenment is not just about deeper self-awareness but helps me to become a kinder person to my fellow man understanding that we are all from the same Source.

But as I have become more self-aware I have realized that my purpose is not just to realize my own worth & happiness, but to ensure happiness of my fellow man too in order to ensure the continuance of my fellow man!

This would not have occurred had I not suffered this loss.Although I have also chosen find deeper answers, equally I may have decided to stay weeping and live in regret and sorrow…

So yes, I am unsure that we HAVE TO SUFFER, but suffering gives us deeper understanding if the suffering brought us compassion…

By: Niloufar

Niloufar — Fri, 01 Oct 2010 22:33:14 +0000

Hi Paulo

I was just listening to your link about ‘suffering’ and what do we think of it.

Well my question is ‘ how do you define suffering’?

Peace
Niloufar

By: Callmeroot

Callmeroot — Sun, 04 Jul 2010 19:58:03 +0000

As I read Paulo’s books, my mind strays to those who have no voice. In the United States alone, 35,000 cows are slaughtered each day so people may dine on flesh. We think of the suffering of people… why is it that people seeking their personal legend do not give up the consumption of flesh, and free others from suffering. Please don’t quote Genesis 1:30- Look to Genesis 1:29 instead….

By: Pearl Harbour

Pearl Harbour — Sat, 29 May 2010 20:07:25 +0000

“La perola e el combate del’ostra”

By: DonFrank

DonFrank — Fri, 19 Mar 2010 04:21:09 +0000

Suffering is the epitome of self importance.
Suffering is only for people who indulge in pain.

Person who suffers usually takes everything either as a blessing or curse without realising that life is about challenges and challenges can not be good or bad. Challenges are simply challenges.

By: Lit

Lit — Sun, 14 Mar 2010 10:53:10 +0000

You just contradicted your statement that we don’t have to go through suffering to find enlightenment by saying that sufferings teaches us what we need to learn. Technically, those lessons brought by suffering gave you the lesson and understanding you needed so that when a similar situation arises, you wouldn’t go through the same pain you did cos you learned how to handle or maneuver around it. Those lessons are the state of enlightenment of life.

But i guess sufferings and happiness itself, as well as their relationship are subjective. And your friend is really lucky to say she hasn’t been through any suffering. It’s not because God thinks she’s too weak to handle any but maybe she’s just too strong to consider anything a suffering. :)

By: Mojgan

Mojgan — Sat, 23 Jan 2010 21:32:29 +0000

I think suffering isn’t a must but helps us to reach enlightenment. We should try to live the life and be happy but we shouldn’t fight with sufffering, it’s part of life. Any suffering has the reason, and beauty of life is beyond all it’s suffering and joy momemnts.

By: David

David — Thu, 22 Oct 2009 07:26:28 +0000

As humans, we exist against all odds. In 1 ml of sperm there are a 100 million sperms and the average ejaculate is 5 ml. Out of that, only one sperm fertilizes our mother’s egg. In addition to that, as far as we can sensually perceive we are the masterpiece of biological nature. Is it any wonder we are gods unto ourselves?

We have a high capacity to enjoy life, and when we suffer it confuses us. We try to attach meaning to it that’s congenial to our ‘god’ status. Life has ups and downs, I guess it’s about finding as many ups as we can, and when we’re down we should use that as an opportunity to further increase our capacity to enjoy life.

By: Anonymous

Anonymous — Mon, 16 Mar 2009 20:10:42 +0000

You do not have to “suffer” to grow spiritually. However, with Christ and his death in mind, it is important to REMEMBER His suffering because it represents love at the greatest. And how can you enjoy life if you do not love everyone, or atleast try to? You really can’t.

I think today, people tend to worry too much about little things, and remembering what Jesus went through can really downplay the minor issues and problems that we come across every day.

I think that when religion speaks of “suffering” it is referring to giving up things that we do not essentially need. I do not believe God expects us to go and die on a cross and suffer becaues He did. I believe though that he expects us to try and humanize ourselves and learn to put others ahead of ourselves. It seems that people make themselves “suffer” without meaningless items. For example, for many people, a week without television is a form of suffering. When the word “suffering” is used, I believe it is sacraficing things we do not need, and learning what is truly important: friends, family and knowledge.

I don’t know, I was kind of all over the place here with my thoughts because im short on time. But, hopefully I got some sort of message across. :P

By: delage elisabeth

delage elisabeth — Sat, 21 Feb 2009 21:36:02 +0000

i think that nobody can escape from sufferings,as nobody can escape from life. (added by Mobile using Mippin)

By: elisabeth delage

elisabeth delage — Sat, 21 Feb 2009 21:20:33 +0000

about jésus,when he was on the cross,do you remeber what he said about god just before to die,i think he showed us what we are,what our human condition is what is also our "perception" of god through the human suffering,does it mean that jésus understands also our difficulties to see the love of god,when we suffer. (added by Mobile using Mippin)

By: Argos

Argos — Tue, 17 Feb 2009 18:08:21 +0000

Hmmm…
Did suffering made me understand something I didn’t comprehend… or didn’t realize?
Yes.
Some people says that one doesn’t really knows what one has until he or she has lost it.
I believe there are somethings we can learn only through experience, being it painful or enjoyable if we are lucky.
Is like learning to walk i suppose… we learn to put one foot in front of the other so we avoid to keep falling. It might take its time, but at the end we learn how to do it. That depends on every person I think. Or better said, that is what I want to believe.

By: Serge L

Serge L — Tue, 17 Feb 2009 08:17:10 +0000

Paulo,
i think the meaning of suffering is over estimated. Pain physical or emotional (that people call suffering) is a part of signal system that has very practical purpose – to tell us there is something wrong with our body or soul. Taken this way it’s good and very important. If it didn’t work we would have destroyed ourselves very fast.

But I don’t like suffering turned into fetish. It is not more important than wholesome body and soul. And if you are healthy you don’t need it. If you are ill and got a signall quick, corrected your way and got well – you don’t need it any more.

Russian philosopher Nikolay Berdyaev said: “Golgotha was not meant to make an idol of suffering but to overcome death and suffering”.

By: marie-christine

marie-christine — Thu, 12 Feb 2009 11:09:57 +0000

Santosh – thanks it is inspirational, I had a friend that could only write with her feet, her handwriting was so beautiful. If they can do it,,,,,,,,,,

Love

By: cesar

cesar — Thu, 12 Feb 2009 09:28:15 +0000

Not everyone has the same idea of what suffering is.
In some ways is life building up something that prepares you for what is to come. For others is a trap they got caught and the pain makes them aware that is time to move…on.
Evolving is “suffering”! like a smal child whose teeth are growing and they cry. Like at the end of an igonizing idea you reach the final conclusion. I feel it is our choice to suffer, at some level, the achieve something. There is an autopilot though that keeps the expectation of agony always there…present. Well: Yes and No, whichever we accept for ourselves.