Since 1989, when I did my second pilgrimage, I discovered the feminine face of God. But for most religions, God is a man.
I believe that God has a masculina and a feminine face, rigor and compassion. So, I’d like to hear your opinion on The Feminine Face of God, or The Goddess.
Thank you!
Paulo
DON’T WORRY ABOUT YOUR ENGLISH. BUT IF YOU FEEL MORE COMFORTABLE, POST IN YOUR MOTHER TONGUE (PORTUGUES, ESPANOL, FRANÇAIS, ETC.).
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Hello,
I think that the divine definitely has a feminine side. I think a lot and when I wish for good things to happen I catch myself thinking about a feminine presence, to whom I direct my thoughts and wishes(for good things to happen).
I think like in old religions, there are many sides to the divine(supreme being or whatever you name you prefer:)). In old norse religion people prayed to different gods depending on what they hoped would happen, and I think this polytheistic way of viewing life is not wrong, it’s just a perspective and I feel the different gods are the different sides of the same ”force”. This ”force” has a masculine side, a feminine side, etc, very dualistic.
Anyhow I’m still young and have a lot of thinking to do.
I love reading your books, Mr.Coelho, since they allow for reflection upon different subjects of our existence and therefore I hope you will write many more beautiful books.
Sincerely, Steffen Larsen.
Yes, I’d agree with this view … God is both and this duality is reflected in everything.
Dear Paulo and friends,
No one so far has said: ‘no God is male only’. It would be intertesting to see if anyone thinks that way and if so what their rationale will be…
Hinduism recognies the masculine and feminine aspects of god:Shiva/Sakthi . But there are many mythical stories that are written about how Shiva and Sakthi fought over who is powerful and which resulted in a cosmic dance competition in which Shiva (masculine) wins and the Sakthi is burned to ashes. The devas (lesser gods) beg Shiva to restore Shakti so that the balance is brought back to the world. Shiva takes ‘mercy’ and restores shakti.
This cosmic dance is re-enacted at a human level in many relationships today where the male ends up ‘winning’. After dancing this ‘dance’ for many years with my husband ..i now understand why sakthi allowed herself to ‘lose’ that competition.
It’s because she does not desire to destroy the one she loves. The family she created. She is a creator not a destroyer and given a choice She would rather ‘lose’ than destroy. She can destroy if she wants to though since she has more power …creation takes more power than destruction.
This is Her weakness but also Her strength.
God is also feminine hence the term: ‘mother earth’ who takes our weight and abuse when we walk, run and jump, drill holes and test nuclear missiles etc … She still gives food and water..because she does not want to destroy her creations.
But once in a while there is a reminder…I am a force to be rekconed with !!(earthquakes, tsunamis etc.)
love,
Laxmi
Dear Paulo
You are so right – God is male and female. Of that I am sure, and do we not get that straight from the mouth of God “Let us make man in our image” Man included male and female and whether this is accepted through the creation story, or through the evolutionary process, the fact remains that we have all the same molecular structure – ie atomic – with our chromosomes arranging our molecules in ways that emphasise and subsequently represent us as male or female. But that does not in any way hide the fact that within each of us, the basic building blocks are the same and our male and female sides are available to be tapped into.
Anyway, can you imagine a male God getting all the colours right on the landscape of the planet, on the plumage of the birds, the wonderful array of flora and fauna that delight our eyes, without the help of Mrs God, or the Mrs God within!?!?!
I always thought God was man. to be a woman is to be weak and God – He is strong. to be a woman is to be humiliated by men.
now I don’t believe in gods at all.
Femenino y masculino son reflejos de la dualidad existente en este plano animal-material. Dios no tiene dualidad el es la unión, la luz primordial a la que todo esta conectado. El se manifiesta de todas formas: Jesús, Maria, Krishna, dioses, semidioses, santos, escritores etc.. de todas las culturas y religiones de la tierra.
Is Love male or female? I think if you try to describe God as either male or female it is like either sex is competing to be superior.
As a Catholic I’d never been brought up to believe that God was male, or female. God is God. I think if people themselves believe that possibly as a male, they are superior and more like God (or vice versa), then they are not very humble are they. It was like the apostles who fought one day and when Jesus asked them what they were fighting about, they were too embarrassed to tell him that it was over who was more saintly.
Querido Paulo
Yo creo que Dios no tiene sexo, no es hombre ni mujer, es un ser Creador de todo y de todos. Sin embargo, lo que tú dices es muy cierto, la sociedad hebrea, le daba preeminencia al hombre, la mujer era un ser sin valor; por lo tanto, tenemos a una figura masculina como Dios, incluso Jesucristo se refería a él como “Padre”, porque eran los hombres los jefes de familia, la “cabeza” de la familia, así que era más comprensible para la gente de esa época, entender el significado de Dios Padre.
A mi como cristiana, no me afecta esa figura masculina, sé que Dios no es un ser como nosotros, con el cuerpo nuestro y por lo tanto, no puede tener sexo.
Como mujer tampoco me afecta, no soy machista, pero tampoco feminista, sé que Dios creó al hombre y a la mujer con los mismos derechos y responsabilidades, así que no me importa dirigirme a El como a “mi padre celestial”, sé que él cumple como padres terrenales con ambos papeles, de padre y madre a la vez.
Lo importante no es “cómo” es él, sino “quien” es el.
Un beso.
I think God is a whole and we have the necesity to name it, everything and averybody is God, women and man living and non living things.
Dear Paulo,
As of my scientific work is really loaded these days, I have been walking in the forest for Nirvana of finding ultimate truth. (Which barely means in simple terms- I am interested in my science work as well together with my spiritual work.) So, I am back here with few words on this week topic. Even though, I know I do not have to please or impress anyone. I am just putting some random thoughts out here-
God is not HE or SHE or IT.
God is God.
A Mysterious body existing in every human unknowingly.
A good side of every creature on this planet.
Feminine side or Masculine side is just our conceptions
The fact is, no Tom, Dick and Harry knows about HIM/HER/IT
A cosmic energy which revolves beyond our imagination.
God is our discovery of unknown
God does not only live in duality (0 or 1, male or female or…)
He possibly lives in singularity (Seeing everything as good)
There is no good side or bad side of god
He is us and we are him
He live in each of our voice and he speak the language of love
Ask a child who will smile at you without any reason
talk with priest he will give thousand stupid lessons
The fact is there is no side of GOD
there is only one side of HIM/HER/IT
that side is called “LOVE”
God bless you all !
Very well writte. I feel a writer in your words.
Love
Alexandra
Good to see you Santosh,
Yes! God is Love, and Love has no gender…even though science has ‘proved’ women are better able to love and care for children than men, often we see men Loving and Caring better than women too.
Love and Admiration,
heart
I had learn that god doesn’t have a face neither a woman or man.
God is creating by my own vision, the goodness of been around the people I love,creating good energy to my life and all this around me, being in contact with my inner of self, believe that life and every day that come with it is “goodness ”, learn to appreciated the beauty of the sunset, the hot and cold, been there, aware that everything around me is moving because of my own consciousness,that I create my own life, and i must learn to judge by own self ,learned from my mistakes and converting the fears of my illusion in Love-Love that will become the god of my everyday life that will guide me and filled me of light in my spiritual journey .
Peace+love = God
Everything and all, whatever I can think, feel, experience, do and live :
in the end falls into the heart, an infinite space ~ + ~ this
endlessly receiving space, Love and Compassion, is for me female, divine……the Divine Female…….Love, Ara
This one I will have to think about for some time.
Querido Paulo si hay algo que aprecié en ti fue desde que leí “A Orillas del río Piedra me senté y lloré” que pude comprobar la importancia del lado femenino, de la Diosa ya olvidada y sustituida por lo patriarcal.
Dios es Trino: Padre, Madre e hijo. Dios y Diosa es la Creación es UNO.
¿Por qué se crean las divisiones?
Restablecer el aspecto femenino de Dios, darle su importancia y con ello darle el lugar a la mujer es importante para una sociedad de progreso.
Ohhh, I wanted to read, tried translator, but it not work, do not translate that text.Why? IN other languages it was ok. So sorry I cant understand.
Love
Alexandra
Mr. Coelho, is it possible for you just to share with me (us) your experience pertaining to seeing the feminine side of God? Jojo.
Eu gosto de pensar na terra com a metáfora da Mãe Gaia..
Abraços grande!
I read a scripture in the Bible that says, “GOD IS A SPIRIT AND THOSE WORSHIPPING MUST WORSHIP IN SPIRIT AND TRUTH” … to me, that says it all….SPIRIT is neither male nor female.. If we believe in the evolution of creation, we know that the Spirit/Energy that makes all things possible is ONE …but one must be truely spiritually in touch with SElF in order to feel in touch with the spirit/energy of others and all the living things and recognize the ONENESS…
Religions are formed to gain power over others and therefore they created in their minds that God is a man..because they use the physical power to describe the power of God … the amazing inner strength of the woman, they pushed aside..
GOD CREATED & GAVE FREEWILL TO ALL CREATIONS TO EVOLVE AS THEY ENJOY LIFE..that’s it…simple as we see in Nature…but, MAN CREATED GOD IN HIS IMAGE, that is why creation became very complicated…
The bible talk of “REPENT because the KINGDOM is NEAR”…
to my mind, REPENTANCE means CHANGE…CHANGE is to EVOLVE….
EVOLUTION is CONTINUATION OF LIFE…but mankind don’t see it that way..they want to complicate things that is why we are in chaos …
the “KINGDOM” is PEACE on earth with SELF & with OTHERS…
sending love to all…oxoxoox..
hazel
Overcoming pain through Faith-Femininemasculineprocess.
There is female and male quality in god.It´s the eternal dance of yin and yang.Both sides are needed to complete the circle.Yang develops yin and vice versa.For me god is not a person with a face,it´s energy,light and completely unconditional love.
Unfortunately our world has turned to the yang/male qualities and is suffering from it.Constant craving for more things to achieve,more money to make,more things to buy are signs of that.Raping mother(ha!) nature,killing her in the name of progress is another.We need to go back to the female qualities to get into balance again.To let go instead of wanting things,to let be instead of doing things,to share and help instead of fighting over profits.
The Tarot has card number one-the magician,who represents the eternal
male quality of impulse,a brilliant mind eager to set things in motion,to conquer and in a way to manipulate.Then there is card number two-the highpriestess,who represents the eternal female quality of the unconcious,feelings,she is the keeper of the book of secrets.Out of these to energies all live is developing…
Male and female energy are equally good or bad,as it may sound as I´m
accusing all the male things responsible for the bad things going on.
The harmony of them is the thing we need to get back to.Being in your centre,at ease with you and the world,not wanting,not needing,not thinking,not craving for-just BEING.This is the moment when we experience god here on earth.It´s free for all of us,it´s inside of us.We just have to open our hearts and souls and do the one
thing that seems so easy and is yet so difficult-LOVE
Last night I met with someone to discuss global sustainability! He’s a physicist with an incredible mind, I think more intuitively, gather information and then the questions come out of that gathering. Together though, working on this problem, with one mind and it’s form of thinking triggering the others, answers to problems, to possible solutions come. So when we come together, the yin and the yang to advance civilization, it works, because our hearts and souls are reaching out.
Thank-you for triggering an answer to last nights discussion, to helping me understand the value of two different ways of thinking coming together.
dear paulo,
I don’t think god has a masculine or feminine side.
To assume that a god that assumes a form similar to humans is arrogance on the part of human beings. A god that created nature, the seas and teh mountains, the trees and the insects cannot be human. These are a zillion life forms on earth and elsewhere and god created all of it, along with the earth, etc. In my opinion, God is a force, neither masculine nor feminine, and unfathomable by normal human psyche. God is a power, a universal energy that radiates through all of the world , the creatures in it, and the universe at large. To fathom God, we must shut ourselves out from the perceived world we have created for ourselves, and delve deep within. I have found great peace and purpose in delving into myself. The joy and understanding i have developed while being with myself for a few months surpasses all the magnificent experiences i have had throughout my lifetime of 23 years.
I’m sorry if i have offended you with my remarks in any way.
Love
Ramiya
Everything we see, believe or experience exists because of our knowledge of it. If we would never hear of world hunger, it would not bother us. If no one talks about god he wouldn’t be on our minds. The female side of god exists because we whisper about it, we get knowledge about the old religion by dubious esoteric books, by reading horrid history like the Hexenhammer in which the Jesuits describe how to hunt down and kill witches. i have been exploring the ways of the goddess for almost a quarter of a century and this summer did i get a glimpse of her that had the lighthearted non-judging brightness i had somehow hoped to find. A reflection of my own lighthearted brightness perhaps. Me in my best hour you might say.
So here is how i came across the last empire of female worship, on
Crete – as any Greek will have anticipated already.
Crete in July is a shimmering hell of heat, in combination with a broken heart and a nasty flu (i didn’t dare to see a doctor for fear of getting diagnosed Mexican pig and being quarantined) this wasn’t going to be the wonderful vacation i had had in mind. My daughter had met some sweet Nigerian children and spend her days in the pool, i was hanging about the room feeling miserable; until – yes until i decided to shove it all.
i rented a car and got us out of that mind deafening resort and into the mind deafening queues of archeological mass tourism: Knossos.
Now you must know that i have a great love for honesty and beauty. Knossos with it’s fake columns and painted concrete added frustration and anger to my heavenly foul mood and i found myself swearing at poor Mister Arthur Evans soul, who probably only meant best when he ‘restored‘ the site with a sheer unbelievable air for destruction. My kid was as disappointed for there was no labyrinth to be seen nor a trace of the minotaur. Mister Evans being dead and not accountable, the sun as hot as ever and an unnerved little voice nagging to return to the pool i decided to look for shade and cool drinks in Heraklion.
What had i expected? i asked myself as i swerved through the hills. A little smile returned when i thought about it. The Minoans, some 4000 years ago had been the last of the known civilizations run by woman. Their splendorous temples were know everywhere and their civilization was so influential that some of today’s words go all the way back to that little island in the Agaen sea. Words for flowers like the hyacinth and the narcis originate from the Minoan language. Young woman from all over would come for temple service, games and fun in the palaces. Temple service in Knossos wasn’t silent and self centered i found out later that day: it WAS fun and games, and i just knew what kind of fun as i looked at the beautiful smiles of the dancing woman wearing exotic dresses that left their breasts bared.
‘Celebration of femininity,’ i thought and began to explain the moon and what it does to us to my kid.
Drifting through the busy streets of the city i came across the sign for the archeological museum. ‘It’s going to be so nice and cool in there’ i promised over lunch. ‘And it won’t take long! ‘– the museum was closed for renovations and only had a little exhibit on show.
We were presented a beautiful show of artifacts. Tiny little replicas of two or three story houses, vases decorated with octopuses and tasteful yet breathtakingly beautiful jewelry. ‘Mam look!’ my kid had found a selection of Minoan toys and wandered around all bright eyed .
The ancient wall paintings still showed the light touches of the brush and i breathed in color and gentleness.
Someone was humming, people were smiling.
Then i saw the painting of the bull, in a arena not unlike the ones where bulls get killed and tortured still today. But this one wasn’t getting tortured: this bull was the jumping and gallivanting toy of some youths that exercised flick flacks and other acrobats on it’s back. ‘Now what is it with bulls?’ i wondered. Someone once told me they were sacred to the Minoans because of their horns that resembled the arched moon. The mirror of the moon here on earth, signifying the beginning and the end of all. ‘They weren’t worshipping bulls, they were worshipping something in the bull that resembled what was sacred to them’.
My thoughts drifted to mount Sinai, before Moses climbed up to receive Christian law he had been appalled by a sect dancing around a golden calf. For the first time i realized who that tribe had been, what the calf stood for, what the gold stood for and i felt calm and at ease for the first time in a long time.
Moses tables brought us separation, with the law in hand we learned to divide right from wrong, left from right, beginning from end as opposed to the life cycle, the never ending always new happy old religion.
Now i understand why we still torture bulls in arenas and celebrate their slaughters. We’re still celebrating the bloody victory of makle law above the natural joyful state of being.
Now i understand how the Minotaur came into existence, the virgin devouring monster of the Knossos labyrinth. A simple human reaction -like children breaking what they can’t have, like jealous neigbors making up slaunder. i walked drifting in my own thoughts and suddenly felt like i was walking through an entrance. To my right and left were two giant double axes, the oversized weapons of the Amazons, and in between them, safe behind a thick plate of glass stood one of the most beautiful artefacts ever made by mankind: a greenish black bulls head, exquisitely made, very naturalistic with gems inlayed for eyes. i’ll admit, i got emotional, that piece of stone touched right on the hollow in my heart. The horns, so beautifully swung, like the outer form of a vessel, how elegantly the hairy curls were pronounced, i was overwhelmed by it’s beauty, in awe of the craftsmanship as well as the symbolic value of the moment.
‘Here i stand eaten alive with ever changing desire in my heart, a slave to longing and forever stumbling into deep wells, forever climbing up again from the steep dark, never quite satisfied and never quite unhappy either, and suddenly it all made sense. It’s just the way it is, decline and fall, it all seems bleak and black and then i raise my pretty head again and let my light shine.
That ole moon makes sense, just as much as anything else does.
Dear Montega,
here is a link to a new Minoan site – Zominthos..
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=kCP9qSQtbX8
With loving kindness,
Satora
Montega,
I loved your story, you took me to that Greek Isle and back to the time when the goddesses would dance, when bulls represented not the power of the stock market but the power of the moon.
Thank-you Nicolette
Paulo Paulo, God is NOT MAN, and God is NOT WOMAN! :-P :-)
God is SUPERIOR of all, God is NOT human bean, God is a non-material personal being. God is Spirit!(Jesus said that!)
Vigor and compassion are just two characteristics of God.
Adam and Eve was CREATED made IMAGE of GOD, not vice versa! :-P ;-)
Jesus was one EXCEPTION!Jesus was one INCARNATION of God, but he was ONLY. He was alpha and omega!
Who is the OTHER SIDE of God?
The other side of God is Humanity, represented like SPOUSE of God.
Jesus (alpha and omega) 2000 years ago had TWO other side: for alpha – Mary Virgin, his MOTHER, for omega – Mary Magdalene, his APOSTLE.
Jesus RAPRESENTED GodLOVE.
Mary Virgin RAPRESENTED humanity who respect the will of God.
Mary Magdalene RAPRESENTED humanity who has LOST the straight way, but then, following Jesus GodLOVE, finds again the peace with God.
Dear Paulo, if you indeed wont to see the feminine face of God, look at me,
Mary Virgin and Mary Magdalene in the SAME person! :-D ;-)
The ones who think they own the TRUTH become intolerant and fundamentalist. Be careful with that.
I see no contradiction between what you say and what Paulo says because he is clearly using symbolism. And if there is any, I consider it irrelevant in my personal case. I don’t like God being understood through reason. There is no way out of it.
Blessed the ones who experience God through intuition.
And blessed you who allowed me to take out my sword.
Dear Gina Re,
nicely said:
“God is NOT MAN, and God is NOT WOMAN!”
I totally agree!
But we are also told that God can be seen as Trinity – one god beeing three, three being one…
…and the tradition sees a male (father) in the trinity, who is often mistaken for god… which would make god male (and unfortunaltely the word god is male – at least in german)
…and the tradition rarely sees a female in the trinity – though there seem to have been different times and traditions in the understanding of the Holy spirit.
…and the tradition sees a male (son) and not a neuter child in the trinity. I do not.
If one wants to see the female face of god, take a look at any woman – or even at a man, but most times one needs a closer look…
(If one wants to see male and female at the same time, look at an inspired artist/musician while art is pooring from her/his soul to manifest in the world. Or maybe better, as we do not have to discuss what is art and what not – have a look at at the children)
But why look at faces, when searching god? Looking outside, looking at surfaces?
As soon as one experienced what lies within or behind, there is no way to say what the outside or surface is like.
So one may remember and discribe ones way to this experience. But is this way god?
In my opinion it is not, one persons way is once more just like a face of god…
So this was not exactly a response to your post Gina Re, but it was inspired by your post…
Love
Bernd
For me Goddess is always existing and present in every layer of nature. In the singing of a bird, in the leaf shake of a tree, in a heartbeat of a newborn. I don’t belive it’s masculine OR feminine, it’s both. It’s Goddess. It is two in the same time as it is being one. Imagine the symbol of Ying-Yang. I think we all, in some way or the other, have our personal Goddess and should be allowed too. But never should we claim our personal Goddess, or God if you like, as being the one and only and using this as a mean to control people and by that limiting their choices, their freedom, their life. The divine is diverse.
One love
Emilios
I had never imagined God as a woman or man. The difference is inside of the human which relates the world by dominating woman or man consciousness. Thinking that God is man or woman that will never change for God Itself but only for you. God will accept you whatever you are…
What comes to mind initially is fear, maintaining a patriarchal society. Women by being the “weaker” sex, by physically not having the same strength, look to males for protection. If in western religion, God is followed, one will be protected. Look at all the mystical aspects of Catholicism, followed for protection. In the family structure, the father usually is the protector, but who is the teacher, the mother, the nurturer, the mother. Perhaps when we have less fear in our lives, we’ll be able to embrace teaching and nurturing, women will be able to tap into their full potential. Both men and women will develop their yin and yang, instead of looking to each other to fulfill, to compliment, they will look to each other to learn from and develop into whole human beings.
God had a feminine presence in ancient cultures (Athena, Nike, Hera, Shiva…etc, and a dual face in Buddhism (yin &yang, masculine and feminine)). You pinpointed quite correctly, Paulo, that it has been reduced to the masculine side at certain stages of our culture and only in some religions.
I believe the masculine/feminine parts are just us trying to humanize what we think God is, so we can have some grasp of the concept.
I give respects to the church for the community involvement, but that’s pretty much it. Even if they would embrace a feminine side of God (which they partially have, by glorifying Mary), that still would open their spectrum by a little, but I’m afraid not enough to limit the damages of indoctrination.
My favorite two names for God, that in my opinion would bring us closer to its essence, are Love and Mystery.
Love and respect,
Anca
Hi Paulo
I would like to look at God and Heaven metaphorically. I believe God, the Devil, Heaven and Hell can be found in people, we are all these religious entities. if we focus on the malice we steer more towards the darker side and can be considered demons. If we steer towards the positive we become saints and angelic like beings. So i agree of coarse God must be both man and woman, god is suppose to represent perfection and balance and we all know without a woman this world will cease to exist and the same without a man.
Rashid Akeem
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Dear Rashid Akeem,
I really like this image of you walking through a door seeing the ocean, the horizon, the sky. This is God’s creation. I believe in a personal God, one with a face of love :)
Love & Admiration,
Heart
yes god has a feminine face, it cannot be any other way.
those who know seem to tell us the ‘manifestation’ of the god universe is like this
the sat chit ananda – core – sat is truth that which always is, chit is consciousness, it is cosnscious and ananda – is bliss, that is the core.
then is maya – the feminie aspect of god which ‘controls’ everything, teh core prefers to remain inert. and maya is but its face looked from one angle.
then comes creations, all that is cretaed, all the intercatiosn, teh manifest universe, with all vigour and valor ! virtue and vice too ( like my smoking habit which i don’t consider a vice )
everyone has both the feminie and masculine aspcets, universe does not allow unipolar entities, at this level of manifestation. simple rule. relegion is a love affair, it is better to love/ pursue the feminie aspect / face of god if u find that u are a man ( don’t get deceived by your body though, sometimes people who have bodies of men and r a woman at heart, or vice versa ) and vice versa. meera, a queen of medival india found salvation through krishna, a male)
let’s top discussing and take a plunge of faith, start a love affair with god whichever form appeals to you, all forms are her/his !
love
aditya
Dear Aditya
Interesting post, I wanted to say that if someone is female, but has been unaware of the Goddess, only the God, I would have thought it would have been more beneficial for them to re-discover the Goddess within themselves.
We are so endoctrinated in the western world, by the belief through religion that woman and the Goddess are and have been second class citizens or purely consigned to the pages of history.
Best regards
Pandora
Interesting. I agree .
You are right.. it is terrible!
Everything is defined through the masculine first…
leaving the feminine to be relegated to subservience.
But… as for Christianity, taken in its lifetime overall… I have no problem with God as ‘male/masculine’.
And this I have learnt from God the father, God the Son and God the Holy Ghost…
I do wonder why a daughter was not sent… but that’s another issue.
What i am concerned with is how the concept that God is ‘male’ has been adopted into a patriahcal society as a means to justify loss of rights for women.
This is not a belief that I feel true Christians share… and yet it is a manifestation that has taken place in society.. and often spoken by those who claim to be Christian. Yet what Christian could deny woman her rights?
No.. I am a Christian and so believe in one God the Father, the Son and the Holy Ghost. And this embraces life in its unity and, balance fully , in my opinion.
Blessings to all ;o)
Hi all,
One thing I often heard in the past was as an accusation by my Lutheran friends of; ‘You Catholics pray to Virgin Mary, not to God’. The “correct” Catholic reply would be; ‘No, we ask Virgin Mary to pray for us, but we pray only to God’. Being a Lutheran myself for some twenty years, then converting to the Catholic Church, one of the thing I appreciate in the latter is an appreciation of the feminine values. The gentleness, the beauty, the aesthetic, the flowers, the songs, the soft kisses Catholics often greet each other with, I would say a love I found, which I hadn’t found previously in my life. Correct me if I’m wrong, but I find the female face IS appreciated within the Catholic Church.
But I also agree with you Paulo. God is both man and woman, which the official Church, apparently hasn’t yet realized. For me the Holy Spirit is the Goddess. I always think about the Holy Spirit in the Trinity as the Female Face of God. So, God to me is Man, Woman and Child, the symbol seen in the Nativity scene. So, why don’t I break loose from a Church who oppress women as bad as most religions seems to do? Oh, I just think, these things take time. Would I join a revolutionary religion, turning things upside down, and say; ‘Hey lets God be Female, let’s worship the Goddess from now on’. Probably not. Would I like to see much more respect for women by religious doctrines and men. Of course, it’s why we need independent novelists and idealists like Paulo Coelho, to show us a better way.
One of the greatest insults to women by the Catholic Church to me, is that it is not regarded a sacrament for females to be ‘ordained’ a nun, to give the final vows of living a religious life, while for men, it is a sacrament to become a priest. If I had power in the Church, this is the first I would change. The argument here is Jesus instilled this sacrament to male apostles, so therefore this sacrament doesn’t include women. This is nonsense, as one could easily say Jesus ‘ordained’ Mary Magdalene, and so extend the sacrament also to include women.
The forever ongoing debate of weather or not women should be ordained priests or priestesses, is a more complicated to me. Frankly, what I have seen in my Protestant homeland of Lutheran females ordained priests and even bishops, is women who behave very, very masculine (many of them openly being homosexuals), and which hasn’t in my opinion promoted the female aspect of religion at all. I am very tolerant and accept that people should be allowed to pursue what they believe is their own dream. But honestly, I haven’t been drawn to this kind of setting.
So, what kind of Goddess/Priestess do I want? I want one who doesn’t yell or scream or pour out anger. I want a Female Face of God to be very soft, gentle and loving, and have a face as my good old grandmother, who was a strong opinionated lady, but who had the best comforting smile, best arm to rest in, in the world.
Love & Admiration,
Heart
church and all reglegious institutions are like the base camp not the summit. so there is no need to be too much concerned about how is teh view from base camp, it has its limitations ( for one the summit itself blocks its view, although one can view one aspect of the summit from all base camps ).
and what is this “i want” – discover what u want, female face, gentle as a mother, enchanting as only a woman can be, and ready to kill if need be !
love
aditya
Thats why although I am a Lutheran, I consider myself an open one, cause I respect and love so much Virgin mary, sometimes I wear also the cross…Well, I think Lutherans love Virgin Mary too, just in another way. And truth is that God is above all and everything, so in some way, maybe is right praying directly God. Infact one can find a priestess entering into a Lutheran Church, so, after all, you can see they respect the feminine concept. I think each religion in some way has this element incorporated, maybe sometimes is not so obvious at a first gaze.
Much love
Alexandra
I do not think that we can put a face on absolute power – neither male nor female. One of the downfalls of humans is that we need to put everything in a box and say “I can understand that because I have given it a name and a place in my life.” I once heard a line that will stay with me for life. “Man trying to speak about God is like travelling to the most remote place in the world and lifting a stone, under the stone there are ants speaking about Stephen Hawkins.” (I have edited this as I cannot remember the original line ;D).
Symbolically speaking it is true; God is seen as a masculine figure in today’s society, of course thousands of years ago there were many female Gods in Roman and Greek mythology. The biggest problem is that men have developed their own views on God and have forced these views onto their society. For example, how women are treated in Iran. Maybe it is a good thing that more developed countries are loosing their religion? It makes room for more developed ideas of absolute power?
I wanted to see how many results on Google there were for
God 362,000,0000,000 versus Goddess 25,700,000
I hope to see one day, (or in another lifetime) that these figures are more equal.
only 336,300,000 to go….
Whoa I got carried away with the zero’s
362,000,000
25,700,000
Pandora!That was brillant!
Great shot Pandora!!!
why bother with that pandora, suppose it becomes equal, how does it help u ?
love
aditya
Pandora, that’s because chasing and hunting is a masculine trait in humans, therefore a boy job. Fight or flight! Feminine should be more subtle, unless they are afer a boy with a well defined feminine side. ;-)
The face of God for me
Brought up in a catholic environment (family, community, society), I saw God through the image of Jesus, being the one that was talked about all the time at church, the images that were shown to me in books at school, Christmas, etc … never questioned. That was educational. But with my mother’s suffering of not being able to be respected in her “feminine” ways of seeing, thinking, wanting to live, etc …, hearing her in her anger at moments, her tears at others, her sadness most of the time and telling me “poor Johanne, as a girl, you will have to fight because there is no place that respects us in the society”, well, with my little mind, I took this as a doom over my head of not being a person important for nothing more than wife and mother, roles, chores, duties, being there for everybody but not me. That started inside me a pain that I carried so long.
I remember … I was like 5 years old, crying in my room, and asking God why he gave me the right to breath and come here on this Earth if my destiny was traced in advance, no possibility of seeing further. I was confused, and realized that long time after, but for a child that confusion brought me to having to accept a “mission” that was I thought dictated by God … to understand that that was dictated by men and Church.
I went along, with no sense, no hope, no comprehension, confusion, sadness, pain, and became a little girl that gave herself the mission of taking car of her mother’s sadness, her father’s needs (since my mother was a woman that was battling inside her and that had an impact on the relation with my father), of my little brother’s fragility (illness). I went along, to school, asking myself “why the society puts money on my education since I have paths that are determined in advance?” Confusion, confusion … trying to love that God that was Love but at the same time doubting his love since for my case it was not liberty and totality. I began to judge the feminine weak, not good for living up to the society, etc …
At 17, rebellion, sudden rebellion … well, I encountered drugs that at that moment healed the pain. Solitary, alone with my pain, no one to express to, talk to, only my drug that understood the pain. Suddenly, I had enough of that inner battle, inner lost, inner pain and closed the door on my family and went along with my new God … drugs …
Came back after a year because that friendship turned itself into a nightmare … Desintoxication, and decided to stop the fight, to stop the pain by … soumission. Found a man, became a wife, had four children, a house, a car … and met new religious people, who talked about a God that loved “me” and believed that yes, he loved me, as a woman.
Started a relation with Christians, Evangelists … wonderful … singing prays to God (loved those moments), and then it started … God wants me to be there for my husband and my children (suggestion: Should leave the job, which I did). Eleven years at home, baking, giving love, taking care of the needs of my kids totally, them first … and then, was educated to place God first, Church first, husband, kids and “me” last. Slowly, panic came inside me, tears, pain, what is happening … God why? Don’t understand … Johanne you should to this, be that woman, etc … Depression appeared and one drink to heal, a new friend found after so many years … return to solitary spaces, anguish, fears, confusion … slowly the face of death was showing its face again …
Leaving everybody, I went and decided to put an end to this pain of not being able to fit in the “society” … better for my husband and my kids (again, not thinking about me). Then, that voice … to try a new path, the last one that I can see, “my path” … asked God to forgive me a time, the God that I was instructed or guided to believe in, and decided to go alone with … the Universe, what the Universe would put on my path …
AA, new spirituality, a God as I see it … a new God started to be part of my life … one that one day after another became more present, more “sane” for me, more comprehensive of my difference … but no face, no images, no nothing … just the name “MY GOD” …
Have been going this path now for almost 9 years. With my past experiences, I am very careful with that subject in my life … I respect other’s people beliefs, at this precise moment in their life, I am not scared of expression though for me what hearing this and that does for “me”. I do not reject all of my past … I only kept what makes sense with me (a sense that I “feel”, a sense that becomes clearer and greater … and so simple! I go on my path with what Universe puts on it, following my intuition, vigilant to capture the signs of the Universe, the messages, going from one hint to another … many abilities grow inside me, understandings come, etc …
As for the feminine side of God, masculine, etc … no citations to give, no books to refer to, no researches … only the profound “feeling” and “sure knowing” that yes, God is a whole, a wonder, both and one, a Creator with no face, no body, no limits “for me”, because I said one day to myself that I will not risk to put him in a box, a definition, an image … “my God” is … no words to express, something inside me … tears of joy, tears of gratitude, tears for his love for “me”, Jojo.
I will read all, because I know that learning never stops … learning is my path … learning is a passion for me … learning for me to grow and be close to “my God”. My God created me, a woman yes, but I am so much more than a woman!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!! With affection, Jojo.
Thanks for sharing Jojo..
We all have our own personal path to GOD….Sometimes we get distracted in our search for our own unique path..Religions and other vices in life, all offer many detours to guide us to our path to God…We go through in life being bombarded with all sorts of falsehood, and we follow..But falsehood distance us even more from our “SELF”.. without SELF, we tend to do things that are harmful to us and to others..in the end, God is within…a feeling of ONENESS/WHOLENESS…It is the desire of feeling of oneness/wholeness of the ‘Image of OUR God’ in us that let us hear “The Voice”… We must listen.. ;)..sending love..oxoxoxo…
hazel….
Dear Jojo,
I wrote a poem sometime ago and posted it in the WOL forum.
When you said :’but I am so much more than a woman.’ it reminded me of that. I will post it again here.
I am!
On the outside I am a woman struggling to be a girl.
On the inside I am a girl struggling to be a woman.
On the outside I am a woman struggling to look younger.
On the inside I am a girl struggling to be wiser.
On the outside I am a woman struggling to be full of care.
On the inside I am a girl struggling to always dare.
On the outside I am a woman struggling to uphold tradition.
On the inside I am a girl struggling to be break convention.
On the outside I am a woman struggling to be a realist.
On the inside I am a girl struggling to remain an idealist.
On the outside I am a woman struggling to forgive.
On the inside I am a girl struggling with the hurt that he gives.
On the outside I am a woman struggling to trust.
On the inside I am a girl struggling with the breach of trust.
On the outside I am a woman struggling to be a good mother
On the inside I am a girl struggling not to bother.
On the outside I am but a shell.
On the inside I am but a well – dark ,deep and an eternal spring of love.
I am!
Writing it gave me a strength and confidence in myself. Be proud that you are a woman!
love,
Laxmi
In each person are male and female values present
thus God also because we are a part of God
I heard it from doctor Love & Sensible !!!!!
Joel, I like your comment. I feel if we are following the Light of God then we should provide strength and warmth. Both are needed. To cause some trouble I will say strength=feminine and warmth=masculine. Is it possible or does it matter because if it is the other way around strength=masculine and warmth=feminine still it is opposite.
I agree with you and I do believe that God is both man and woman.
At school, we were led to believe that God is a man, even the language we used supports that “men are powerful” and that “men holds all knowledge” and I simply don’t agree with that.
I am glad that I am born of this century for in this age, we, as women, are empowered and are no longer kept in a silent majority nor forced to embody a certain quality, only to be labeled as a “woman” – of someone lesser.
I believe in justice and equality, I believe that God did not create differences so we can compete against each other but has created them so we can support and supplement our own strengths and weaknesses.
I believe that when the time comes that we have realized that our being is not brought about what the society dictates but what our hearts and beings extends, without our knowledge, we will see the face of God.
I often wonder, why babies can look either male or female. If not for their genitalia and their chromosomes, they can be mistaken as either/or. I see God in all babies – it’s a sign of life, and beginning. I see God in sunrise and sunset – it’s a sign of magnificence and hope. I see God in people – it’s a sign of belongingness and unity.
For me you said some true and understandable things about God and society. I am also glad I was born in this century too. When we look around the world I feel so many people who believe in God need to get to know God more. You can not know someone through someone else(religious speaker).
It is a shame that the Bible has been the object of so much censorship throughout the ages – words, phrases, sometimes whole passages or books, altered or wholly deleted to suit the needs and wishes of those in authority. For centuries, rulers of both church and state have had a hand in shaping the Bible to suit the message THEY wanted people to extract from it. And yet, even despite their best efforts, they did not manage to eradicate all vestiges of the Feminine Face of God. There remains, even to this day, a passage in Genesis, which very clearly indicates the dual nature of God:
“God created man in His own image, in the image of God He created him; male and female He created them.” Genesis 1:27
It requires only the most miniscule shift in thinking to comprehend this passage in its ORIGINAL meaning. We are taught to read this passage as “man” (the male, Adam) was created in God’s image. But what if we read, instead, “man” in the sense of “humankind”?
God created HUMANKIND in his/her own image, in the image of God He/She created him – male and female….
Our language is weak, full of faults carried over from the dark ages of patriarchal rule, in which it was shaped and formed. We lack, even today, a dualistic pronoun which encompasses the concept of his/her, he/she. Even the word “humankind” is masculine in its connotations – it is a “him,” not a “him/her.” Even so, it does not take a far stretch of the imagination to arrive at the originally intended meaning of such passages.
It is very important to remember that, although the Bible is a “holy book,” it is not static. It has not traversed the passageways of time, untouched. At almost every turn, it has undergone the knife of censorship under the hand of those who sought to utilize it as a tool for political power and control. Just as those who came before us have shaped it and left their mark upon it in accordance with what they believed to be a accurate reading, so too is it now our turn to leave our mark upon it for those who will come after us – it is our responsibility to REread it and reinterpret it to reflect this new understanding of God as both man and woman. This, we owe to those who will come after us.
This, I believe, is really the way God/Goddess intended for the Bible to be – not a static and dead object, but a living text which would evolve along with humankind and his/her ever-progressive understanding of the world and all creation.
Going back to this passage in Genesis: Even if one does not believe that this was the “original” meaning, it does not matter. What DOES matter is OUR understanding today of the nature of humankind and the world – we mustn’t fail to exercise our rational thought and modern understanding when reading the Bible. We must not let the Bible shackle us to the dark ages, but make of it something which is meaningful for us today. For example, the whole book of Joshua is but a blood-bath, yet, as we recognize today that “holy wars” are vile in every way, we do not read this book as a proclamation in support of such atrocities. We exercise our good reason and contemporary understanding in order to re-interpret this book. So too must we do with the whole of the Bible, in terms of our modern day comprehension of the essential equality of man and woman. It is absurd to cling to a past that holds no truth for us today. We must have courage to reread and reinterpret the Bible as we see it, clearly, with the eyes of reason and compassion.
Much Love,
Savita
Josefina muy buena.
Well said, Savita. Thanks. If we insist on seeing God in the limiting terms of language, then I pray to ‘Our Father in Heaven’ and ‘Our Mother on Earth,’ and accommodate it that way. If, ‘In the beginning the was the Word, and the Word was God,’ then that signals to me our first intellectual recognition of the Cosmos. The moment we ‘name’ something, we remove it from the reality of neurons and atoms and move it into the abstract realm of language…very limiting. Thanks again.
I agree Savita, I like the way you have expressed this. It is mundane language conceived by mankind to describe the perfect unity of God. For me the stories describe the miraculous by conceiving miracles, it’s like painting a gold nugget with gold paint.
Male/Female is so RIGHT. I can’t conceive of it being any other way.
With love, Daniel
Savita:
why him/her & god/goddess?
why not her/him & goddess/god?
K
Dear Paulo,
I don’t have special knowledge in this topic and i completely accept with you and i now some how remember that similar message was conveyed in Dan brows Davin chi code. And in India Though we worship millions of gods both male and female but many just fail to understand the message.
Hi Paulo..Its funny how sometimes common sense just passes us by..well me anyway..I was brought up a catholic and always thought of God as a man…at the same time I was reciting from my catechism ‘God made me in his own image and likeness’. I know we cannot take all literally but just thinking about that for me now I believe in God is both man and woman. I dont think there are certain qualities that only belong to men and others that only belong to women. I think in both men and women are the same qualities. I think it is more comforting in a spiritual sense to think of God as both man and woman. Thank you for bringing up this topic. With love to you Paulo.xxx
In my opinion, God has two faces and He (the conventional “He” that is used in The Holy Scriptures) made the dark and the light, the day and the night, and the two sexes, Man and Woman, from His own figure and beauty thus balancing the Universal Scale. His feminine side gave Him His strongest power: Love.
Paulo, para mim Deus não tem face feminina ou masculina,porque é uma energia superior a todas as energias e criadora de tudo o que existe.Não atribuo a Ele, nem à energia Yin, nem Yang.Quando tem que atuar de uma forma Yin,atua.Quando tem de atuar de uma forma Yang, atua.E nós seres humanos fazemos parte de história Dele.
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Dear Alexandra,
You mention that in Yoga philosophy (Hinduism) there is a clear comprehension of the feminine aspect of the Divine: Devi (in her myriad forms), also referred to as the Shakti energy which animates what would otherwise be a cosmos of dead and lifeless matter. You are so right – it seems that it is only we here in the Western world who have not caught on yet. In the great religions of the East (Hinduism, Buddhism, Taoism, for example), this understanding of God as both man and woman has been long-standing. Why is it that only we here in the West seem to have such difficulty accepting this notion?
And, by the way, you are a wonderful speaker!
Much Love,
Savita
Dear Paulo,
Just wanted to say that I highly admire you for stating your belief so clearly and strongly on this subject, even though it stands in opposition to “official” church doctrine. If there is any risk of censure, you seem to have no fear of it.
Often you offer us topics, but keep your own opinion to yourself, I would assume because you do not wish to influence the opinions of others. I always appreciate this, because this is what sets the tone for a truly open forum. However, this time you HAVE stated your opinion, quite strongly, and this too I think is very appropriate, considering the topic. You stand as an example not to be hesitant to speak one’s beliefs, even when those beliefs run contrary to the official teachings of the church.
This, I think, is the only hope that the church, and the world as a whole, will undergo a change of opinion on this most important topic – when those who do believe in the Goddess begin to speak up and speak out, fearlessly and without reserve. Who knows – maybe somewhere in this forum will arise that decisive “hundredth monkey.”
Thank you for offering us this opportunity.
Sincerely,
Savita
Dearest Savita,
I loved your eloquent words. You are a lady!
My respects,
Anca
It is true that the Church, the Orthodox Catholic and most known religions promote the idea that “God” is male, and there are no tangible evidence of their sex, since no one has seen.
The man in the effort to apprehend the divine and to associate with nature returning to God apart from human feelings and human form.
Certainly the perception of the nature of the Divine does not always coincide with the well-established position as today, the multitude of those reports and the findings confirm the view that man praising the power of female sex to generate, to create the life has made as the ultimate power and therefore the first sacrifice was to the “Great Mother”, the “Goddess of fertility and creation. For primitive man, therefore God was a woman, after fertility was required at the time and anyone who had (the female gender) could be established and the fate of race and survival.
Later, our societies, with few exceptions over the years, there have been sexist in their structure and the church adopted this model because it was founded by men and were very reasonable and next to promote the idea that God was also a man.
Such a claim and also provide the necessary justification both the possession and management of power in any form of men, and to eliminate and degradation of female power and thus by the Church.
The rest is more or less known to womankind, not only deteriorated and had no less clear and formal access to power but sykofantithike very strongly by the Church and was associated with sin, as this infamous and therefore in no way has affected the God, who were considered as “male virtues”.
Of course most of you now know the story of “Immaculate Conception” and “Fatima”, while others through the engagement and the interpretation of sacred texts are discovering that the “God” may not be male or perhaps only male.
Compassion, patience, forgiveness and compassion are virtues that are found only in men but mostly women-mothers, and perhaps this indicates the female nature as Creator.
God told the man that “I am ” “εγώ ειμί ΩΝ” indicating His presence not His/Her sex
Also He added, and “in my image and likeness” and because the two sexes are likely to be both man and woman, just as we coined.
But if I may say the important thing is what is the gender of God, but whether the Church today can meet the new concepts that have begun to prevail on the female gender and whether they want to withdraw what action to take, to erase practices , perceptions and slanderers against the female gender for centuries thereafter.
God and Goddess come Hand in Hand.
She says: “Veni, Vidi”
He says: “Vici”
That is their Mystery of Success.
That was Caeser.. and he got stabbed in the back…!
;)
Spatial Clocks…. the mystery unfolds.
“Kendo” of the Fool.
15 – 16 Oct, 2009 (Netherlands)
It was my first “initiation” into the “circle of life”. No, I wasn’t “initiated” into the “Goddesses”. More appropriate for the ‘Monkey’ is to be initiated into the Fools. So, I’m back at home with 10 juggling balls: 3 blue, 3 yellow, 3 silver. The last one is labelled: “THE POWER TO CHANGE”.
Yes, I’m going to use my “balls” now.
Of course there is a feminine face to God!We are duals,made of Yin and Yang.Yes we have repeated this here many times and yet,some need to have their memories refreshed!So those men who are beating up women and more,know that when you do so,you are hurting God too.
Hum..a HUGE act of evil and injustice that is still going on and that isn’t talked much about:
http://www.amnestyusa.org/document.php?id=engamr410122006&lang=e
http://www.hrw.org/en/news/2006/06/26/mexico-candidates-must-address-murders-women
http://www.feministezine.com/feminist/international/Gender-Violence-in-Mexico.html
Ni una mas!Yeah..but when??
Para mim, Deus é energia, vibrações, racionalidade e sensibilidade. E isto não tem sexo.
While talking to a protestant preacher about our wedding, we had this topic (feminine face of god). The preacher told me about about a church in bavaria – I unfortunately do not remember which one – which has a very nice picture of the Trinity:
… with the holy spirit shown clearly as a woman!
So the Trinity would be a complete family! Which makes God male, female and child :-)
… and I would not attempt to bring them into any order – though I am used to the order of the sociaty I live in…
I love the idea of god-family – and my idea of the child in this family is not the idea of a male Jesus, but of a child as something that differs from the idea of male and female…
… and looking at my family, I must say, that I am happy about a strong female spirit.
I guess each of the 3 parts (male, female, child) is needed to allow the other two parts
- to feel as one without getting lost in symbiosis
- to feel independend without loosing each other
Dear Bernd,
I like your idea very much – this concept of a Trinity wherein the feminine aspect of God assumes her rightful place, alongside the masculine. For some reason, the doctrinal concept and treatment of the Virgin Mary annoys me greatly. It isn’t that I’m not willing to venerate the Virgin Mary, but that her sainthood seems to me only a poor consolation on the part of the church. It allows people an outlet for veneration of the feminine, but it still relegates the feminine aspect of the equation to a lesser position. In accordance with church doctrine, the Virgin Mary is NOT God/ess – she is “just a human,” nor was her role in the birth of Christ self-willed. She is seen as merely “an instrument” of the Divine, but wholly lacking in equality with the strictly masculine God-head. This is not enough. It does not suffice. It does not appease me. As I say, it only annoys me – that the feminine should be relegated to such a position and that we are expected to be pleased by and satisfied with this. I am not.
In keeping with your idea of a “family Trinity,” I would like to propose one more addition to that theory. Let us say that “God” is masculine and the “Holy Spirit” is feminine, and the two are equal, comprising a perfect balance of energies: God/Goddess. But Christ was a man. Here, again, we find ourselves unbalanced. But the story is not over…yet. We await Christ’s return, do we not? Let us suppose that when the Christ returns, that “messiah energy” takes the form not of a man but of a woman. THEN we would have a perfect balance in the “family.” This is what I would await next – not another male savior, but a fully female messiah.
Just a thought….
Love,
Savita
Dear Paulo,
Thanks for sharing.. If all men see God the way you do, women and children won’t suffer in societies where God is a man..
It takes a real gentle man to see the feminine face of God ;)…
Wouldn’t it be wonderful if everyone see the both sides of God?..
I see the masculine and the feminine sides of God through Nature..
xoxoxoxox..
hazel
Thank you so much Paulo for this question.
The Goddess is more than a jungian archetype to me, She is in everything, just as God.
The two do not exist without each other, they are polar opposites, of a unifying whole.
One.
The Great Goddess was in existence at the dawn of wo/man, as is shown in archeological evidence throughout the centuries, it is only the more relatively recent patriarchal religions that have tried to obliterate all trace of feminine divinity and power.
The Goddess has always been in my heart, and I remember when I visited a bookshop in Hastings over twenty years ago, how delighted I was that the Goddesses name was being re-acknowledged, when I found a book there… now there are many on the subject.
I will be very interested to read everyones posts on this.
Thank you so much again,
Love, Love, Love
god or goddess, feminine or masculine, good or bad are all manifestations of that sacred energy that is amongst us yet not affected by us. Actually we are the myth , our story is mythology as the reality is constant, unchangeable yet beyond so called logic or interpretation.According to the famous poet ghalib, giving words to the truth being told in the veda or maybe even beyond, .. “na thaa kuch to khuda thaa, kuch na hota to khuda hota, duboya mujhko hone ne, na hota main to kya hota”, meaning ..when there was nothing there was god, had there been nothing there would have been god, I am doomed or destroyed because I am present as ego, had I(my ego) been not there what would have happened , who would have been there?
eternal question , unquenched thirst, ever continuing journey, only god knows the answer.If and when we meet with god all the questions drop and there is a deep silence, neither the question is important nor the answer.
hello,
I was only born in 1989, and simply was always thought that God is man by my grandmother. But as i was growing i realized for myself that God is nothing, that we can understand. God is substance that contains everything good and evil, man and woman.
In my opinion Feminine Face of God is everything beautiful that is around us and especially LOVE, that main function is to give, like mother to a child, like ground to grass.
Thank you
“Love, like ground to grass”
Beautiful, beautiful, beautiful! Thank you!
Dear Savita,
I can fully understand your feelings about virgin mary… for me (raised as a protestant) Virgin Mary is not more or less important than any other mother in the world. This is in some parts much more than the the doctrinal concept allows Mary to be, in some it is less. Every mother has been much closer to the secret of life than most men will ever be… if they will experience this as a spiritual source for their life is a completely different question.
… still also men have their experiences with life – but many talks with male and female friends seem to show that male spiritual search is different from female. Maybe birth is the reason.
The returning messiah being a woman would be a really nice ending for christian history!
My idea about family Trinity though is still a little different. It is more like another (quite different) version of Trinity:
the Hinduistic Trinity with Creator, Keeper and Destroyer.
The common thing is:
Three concepts that go hand in hand and still each of them is the antithesises of the others…
And for me in “family-Trinity”, their is a child (neuter/neutrum) and not son (male).
Jesus is really very important for me – as being pure love… and many here seem to think that pure love is a female concept… :-)
For me Jesus is not “its” body or “its” form or “its” role and place in society. Jesus is what “it” means to me.
If it is important for Jesus to be male, to let pure love touch some more people – let him be male… ( maybe this is just a trick like the wolf who dresses in sheeps-wool to get closer to the sheep… ;-) )
I do not care about a possible male Jesus in history. Anyway, any spiritual source and any great spiritual work is within the whole and completeness of the trinity – no matter how it shows inside the world.
… wow, you finally made me talk about more than concepts and ideas… I guess here is a lot of what I really believe…
So thank you – I was really happy about your reply.
Love,
Bernd
Dear Savita
Personally I do not want any Messiah, female or male, unless the whole world was One.
Why? Because all (if not most) religions cause wars, all done in God’s name…
But that is another subject…
Love
Pandora
reading some other comments about male word first, I think I have to correct myself:
I wrote
“… the Hinduistic Trinity with Creator, Keeper and Destroyer …”
… here we go again – I used male words without thinking it male, without realising and without knowing enough about hinduism (is this thought male, female or both or nothing?)
so lets say with the concepts of creating, keeping and destroying…
(very basic hinduism knowledge from schools philosophy course… I hope this is correct)
Oh, dear Savita, I am glad you were able to understand my dicourse. The emotions made me forget words…Thanks for reply and for being so kind.
Love
Alexandra
Dear Aditya,
Did you have a bad day or something? Thanks for your comment as always. Your metaphor of the ‘base camp’ and ‘summit’ is enticing. As Church authorities in my opinion, does have the key to the truth and to the wisdom, and I therefore out-most respect it, there is always the truth and wisdom in each heart, where God the almighty often speaks directly too. So, I must disagree with you on ‘not be too much concerned about how is the view from base camp’. We should listen, and if we strongly disagree, take part in work to change things the way we believe. When the opposition is growing strong enough, what you call the ‘summit’, will grow in influence. ‘Never doubt that a small group of dedicated people can change the world. Indeed, it is the only thing that ever has’. Margareth Mead.
I am sorry I came across rather masculine with my ‘I want’…You are so right, how I should more femininely express myself, would be to say ‘I would like’. Sorry about that. I am far from as feminine as I’d like to be!!! Working on it :)
Your last line I most strongly disagree with; ‘ready to kill if need be’. Hey, where on earth did you see this in my posting? Of course believing in the feminine face, life giving principle, there would be no killing, it would be as you say ‘gentle as a mother’ supporting life, not ruining it.
Aditya, I wish I could spend a lot more time in India or Tibet or Asia, to learn much more about Hinduism so on, as I admire so much the peaceful and feminine aspects of your religion. Was this killing remark, an upset from you about the killing by ‘my’ Church in the past? If so, I understand your comment. This the Church have asked forgiveness in public, and we should every day work to make up for violence like that towards anybody. Aditya, your religion is so wonderful with its burning of incense, daily prayers, colorful customs and festivals, loving mothers caring for their children and husbands. Share with us, why is the feminine principle stronger in your culture do you think? It’s all about inner peace…’Let there be peace on earth, and let it begin with me…’ as a popular song goes. Should we women just all take a vow of silence and quit talking like men :))
Love and Admiration,
Heart
Ohhh, dear Heart, I dont think is a good idea starting to compare, there is nicer or no. And from far all seems nicer. One must live the thing in order to feel it. I wont go further, maybe I talk too much.
Love
Hi heart !
u speak of a bad day, here we are going through a bad bad week, with daily work for 12-13 hours no holidays etec. because we are racing agisnt time to finish some parts of a big project in plant shutdown. as suaul my bosses didnot listen to me and we went in with awful planning, now everyone is slogging and we will make it, but the slogging could have been avoided with slight chnage in mind set. bosses’s chair is a unique place, it makes most of its occupnats feel that just because they are sitting on a chair, they deserve it also. accapting innovative ideas, specially from subordinates, requires a big heart. anyway enough ranting !
hey 1 i have no issues with u comming as masculine, in fact that was not at all on my mind when i wrote what i did. this attitude ” i want” whoever has, man or woman are going to find it difficult to unravel mystries, mystries become enjoybale when u ‘don’t wnat’ u just play along.
and please never ever think that men would be happy if women stopped talking to them, to tell u the truth it’s women alone for which men make all teh show about masculinity etce tec.
i agree that u should be more feminine if that is what u want, yes a female will blossom not as a man but as woman.
about that killing, some misunderstanding again. u have not written it anywhere, i did. remember godess durga, during durgapooja she is worshipped in form where she is slaying demons. that killing, when need be. a woman who is otherise very shy may even kill when her family specially children are threatened, why it happned just the other day when a kashmiri lady killed wtwo terrorsits bare handed ( almost, she did it with an axe ) who were armed to teh hilt.
connect with the divinity which is alreday within you, which makes u such a nice human bein and be at peace. u and all wols are welcome to come over to india anytime, yes it’s a fascinating country. but be careful, lots of impsoters have also set shops, and u know what the imposters look more real than the real once.
love
aditya
That was lovely. Glad I read it.
Laxmi, those words … like if I had written them. Thank you. You know, I just got realized how much it is difficult for me to be and accept the “woman” in me, and I see just in finishing my comment I say “I am more than a woman” … my struggle … to be able to see the feminine side of God I need to see my feminine side, well, accept her more, respect her more, love her more, see her forces instead of weakness … that is it! Going to explore that side and I know personnaly where that leads me :-) Thank you for sharing this lovely poem, so profound, and your comment had me stop and see something that was passing by … have to work the feminine in me! :-) Jojo.
I really like your poem.. thanks for sharing here ;o))
I would tend to agree with you Pandora. And at the same time, human beings, in their progress toward the creation of a New World, still have need of natural leaders, exemplars, torch-bearers, and the like. Unfortunately, all too often, throughout history, these roles have been reserved for males.
Wonder if you’ve ever seen the film “Nausicaä of the Valley of the Wind.” It is predominantly a children’s movie, but thematically it is also quite effective on an adult level as well. A beautiful film, about a sort of female “messiah,” a young girl who comes to usher in an age of peace in a post-apocalyptic world torn apart by war against both man and nature. The funny thing is, the people were expecting a messiah of peace, as such had been prophesied long before, but they had assumed it would be a boy, not a girl.
Dear Alexandra,
Please, no offense to Lutherans. I am just talking about my own very limited experiences. And the end of my post, I hold my grandmother as an example of female face of God. She was a Lutheran till her dying day…rest her soul.
Love,
Heart
xxx
then virgin mary is your god, your personal god ! pray to her play with her.
love
aditya
Ohh dear Annie…I did not know. Anyways you sound always a sweet person.
I was reading your comment, dearest Swannie, and I felt your loneliness and sadness.. Then your p.s. made me … smile! At least you know that I love you… unconditionally and purely.
LOVE,
Mamma Thelma xxx
p.s. It is a nice feeling to sit by the Mother knowing there is nothing to worry about… I still go and sit by my mother’s side and ask her, as my … usual question: ‘Do you love me????’ I just need to hear the ‘I LOVE YOU’!!
Very nice thought, Annie, and that makes a great deal of sense too – that not only you, but probably all of us, seek in God/ess what we feel we have missed in human relations. I tend to conceive of God, most often as a male – extremely masculine, sensual, virile – the muscle-bound and acutely handsome Shiva, seated upon an animal-skin rug, his arms adorned with snakes, his face wreathed in a wild, dark mane of unkempt locks. I don’t think this is the ONLY face of the Divine, but this is the face to which I have been most powerfully drawn throughout my life. I’m sure that this too is somehow related to my own personal psychology. I wouldn’t want to try to figure that one out, though, because I think it would take too much of the mystery out of it for me. I rather like not knowing why it is that I am drawn to Shiva or why that form speaks most profoundly to my own heart.
With much love to you, Annie!
Savita
Dearest Annie
I sympathise with you.. as a ‘daughter’ ;o)
Does the light of the moon stop shining?
No.. The light of the moon is strong..
as is a mother’s love.
We must as daughters learn to live even when the moon is hidden – by day or by cloud.
For me… the moon is where my soul revealed truthfully…
as it is with my life where I strive to have a close and meaningful relationship with my beloved mother.
It’s not always easy…
but as i love the moon.. so i love mamma mia.
It’s a relationship worth fighting for…
Imagine night-time without the moon!! ;o)
So, sunny one – I am wishing … many blessings to you <3 <3
Wonderful. Thank you for saying that.
Love
Alexandra
Yes pandora !
about time, the politics, the crap is removed from religion and truth is revealed ( simple truth that which is sum total of everything is everything, it’s as much masculine as feminine ) and let’s also remember that story paulo shared on the blog where god takes the form of birds to convince a person that god did take human forms to convince humans, of their ultimate posiibility, godliness !( and that includes playfullness )
love
aditya
Dear Marta Adriana, I am intolerant and fundamentalist only in LOVE, becose I am PASSIONAL one! ;-)
Paulo Coelho understand my (serious) joke! :-D
You see no contradiction between what me say and what Paulo says?!
We too! ;-) :-D
Dear Bernd,
just for change my opinion:
If God is MAN (Father and Son), I am SURE that God is NOT woman!!!
… becose I am women! :-D ;-)
“Cinderella”
To be perfectly honest, it would give me huge pleasure!
:D
let´s make it a mantra:
do you love me?
I LOVE YOU
do you love me?
I LOVE YOU
do you love me?
I LOVE YOU
:-)
im enjoying it
Ammaji quote:
“Is God male or female? The answer is neither: God is That. But if you must give God gender, God is more female than male, for He is contained in She.”
I wish I had a mother with my side :)I remember last time I talked to my mother on the phone, I did not wanted to quit, because I wanted to say Mom for maybe the very last time. Those words “Mom” and “Dad” I have not used for so many years. Annie sweetie, ja, feelings are like horses sometimes :)
then it’s ahhright !!
i cannot stop my giggles with this honest answewr.
love
aditya
PS : but think again after u have ‘consumated’ your pleasure, why ?
Dear Aditya
I am glad you too also gained some pleasure, but what normally happens after a consummation? Maybe a new child, a new age, a new epoch of wo/mankind.
Google is just a search engine, but is to me an indicator of the awareness of the Goddess in the world.
Love
Pandora
Now the figures are:
364,000,000 for God and
025,900,000 for Goddess
That is an increase of 2,000,000 for God and 200,000 for Goddess, same old story, once you chase a man, they run a mile :D
Pandora.. that’s hilarious…. what on earth caused such a leap in google articles in, what.. 2 days.
Definitely too much yin or is it yang… anyway.. masculine dominating the topical forums ;o)
Nancy,
Thanks for the positive critic.
Yes I think like Annie! Thnx Hilde!
This is the essence of it all-to be outspoken and tell our own “truth” no matter who we are or how we live.There will always be another person who needs this particular information to go on…
I´m glad I could be of service to you…
Take care.Love,Andrea
Hi Annie,
In answer to your question:-
Yes, I would mind if god was ‘labelled’ as a SHE and not HE!
Just as I would mind if god was ‘labelled’ as a HE and not SHE!
In my earlier post, I mentioned how God (for me) has both male/masculine and female/feminine qualities, each of which are in harmony with one another. It is because of this that all of us can relate to him, irrespective of our gender.
Of course, God’s ‘FACE’, ‘PRESENCE’, call it what you will, is all around us and through prayer we become ONE with ‘HIM’.
It is important to realise that there is no RIGHT or WRONG way of seeing or experiencing God. I think there is always the danger in this kind of discussion, of certain susceptible people being left with spiritual DOUBT and UNCERTAINTY, leading to inner questioning and suffering. It is not easy for these people to find good spiritual advisors.
It is an interesting discussion, as always on this blog. I just wonder what God is thinking of all the labels which have been placed on him this week!
Take care,
Love Theresa
Hello darling!
:)
Dear Montega & Nicolette,
I do not want to disappoint you but bulls were sacrificed in Minoan Crete. No, they did not just jump over them….
And because Minos didn’t sacrifice Poseidon’s white bull (selfish reasons) …poor Pasiphae (his wife) was cursed and got a frenzy for the white bull and so Minotaur was born (according to myth)
As to Moses and going up the mountain to get the law tablets from God…Minos did the same thing up on Mt. Ida – Zeus cave …every 9th year (end of 100 lunations – one great year). If you read Plato’s “Laws” you will see that the whole conversation in this book takes place walking up to Zeus cave (Mount Ida) from Knossos. Believe me the setting of Plato’s “Laws” is no accident.
Oh yes and I forgot there was human sacrifice in Minoan Crete (not only the youths sent from Athens – and if they were not sacrificed as surrogates for the king they ended up as slaves – the maidens served in the temple).
Just keep on dancing with the goddesses or gods from ancient times they were and still are very bloodthirsty…and they always get their dues paid in one way or the other…not even Ariadne for whom Daedalus built the famous dancing floor at Knossos was spared.
Dear “Cinderella”,
Yes! – but why for a change?
ok, I am man (… and not even close to a prince) :-( ;-)
… just to avoid misunderstanding:
if I say god can be seen as Trinity,
I do not say “god is father” …
:-)
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=2Xn9LWXj-BA
Frankly , even if all is not good to say: me I did not have to laugh…yesterday evening by leaving the computer after a long reading the blog,
The tears of my soul , tears of blood flowing in sadness . And then I thought to Moses going down of the mountain …
And I am reminded , going down in the mountains: “go toward them , Yes , but the task and so great , and are they ready? “Yesterday , i rethink this sentence “are they ready? ” And I also think that the path in the not God is sometimes a difficult path when it is a path among the homes , so sweet and when it is in your path , Lord …
Because with friends , it must share the good and bad times and not to leave : i like my next , but sometimes it confuses me before ideas if distant from God …
I must say as Paulo Coelho: i must spend less time before the computer , and energize me for return? Should I continue my path toward other horizons because God guide my not …
And I understand the pain of small thorns –oh Marie guide me and help me to assist
I was “guided” toward you , I have read the feelings of universality , I am delighted to read it and sometimes surprised , and sometimes I learned so many things that have awakened my appetite intellectual…but I must admit that some posts leaves me perplexed …
I do not judge , since each path has its own path , is it mine is of very far before “Our extraordinary meeting but sometimes i want more understand the why of certain reasoning contemporary …
Without doubt that the happiness of events spiritual i have removed if top , that the back to “on earth” is difficult and sometimes confusing … it is therefore certainly an adaptation of my part, to love and to love even and find the right words , and actions fair …
And as I said on 29 June: Not at once , i want to remain with Men , i love them so much and I have a action to do … Then my words for you all , if generous to give your time for each posts and each reading : I love you
I need to share these words with you. Thank you for having read…
Love
Sido
U ARE AN ANGEL, SIS
XXX
Dear Annie
Sadly families sometimes provide our biggest tests and adversaries.
My friend said he has found that with two patients of his, their Mothers tried to cling too much to their daughters and control them. One he helped, the other he couldn’t, as she wouldn’t move out of the home, she was too weak to stand up to her. Words can be cruel and of course emotional blackmail.
Sometimes you have to break free, to be yourself and not what others want you to be.
Don’t ever be afraid to show your face to the light Annie, you are beautiful inside and out, of that there is no doubt.
Love you
Pandora
Hi Annie,
this is interesting: two comments that talk about a butterfly on this page.
here the meaning of the animal totem “butterfly”:
(http://www.linsdomain.com/totems/pages/butterfly.htm )
Transmutation, Dance of Joy
The butterfly is the symbol of change, joy and color.
It is the symbol of the soul.
Enjoy the butterflies :)
K
Thank you, dear Annie.
You are right, the butterfly was a very precious sign. This reminds me of my recent visit to England. I went to collect my granddaughter (8 years) from school. When the school bell rang she rushed out of the door shouting (Grandma! Grandma!) She put her hand into her pocket and took out a ladybird! She was so happy to have found her in the garden. This tiny creature was her entire world! It was a Divine moment for us both!
Love, Theresa
For Annie and Thelma ;o)
La Mariposa -
a story recounted of the butterfly woman dance
http://utahenvironmentalhumanities.blogspot.com/2009/09/la-mariposa-butterfly-woman.html
Swannie, do you have any … percussionist in .. mind?????
Where are YOU Paul?? We have missed you.
LOVE,
Thelma xxx
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